Discussion:
Max Pacs
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Marty
2016-12-12 05:00:34 UTC
Permalink
Worst captain in team history.

The infamous, non-backchecker (on one infamous play).

The guy who is both a coaches pet, and hated by his coach. At least,
according to all the rumors and opinions that surround him.

Aside from that, he leads the 1st place NHL team in goals and points,
after playing though November on some version of a broken foot.

Seriously, he may not play a "hard" game, but he is an effective player,
when not hurt. He goes to soft areas because, unlike most players, he CAN
score from those areas, because he shot is so heavy. If he spent all his
time crashing creases, he'd never be able to feature his heavy wrister. No
one asked Gallagher to blast 20 goals per season using 30-40 wrist shots.
Why do they want Pacs to get all his goals mucking in the crease and
slamming home garbage, and leave his wrist shot unused?

That said, I do want Pacs to develop a more "mucking" attitude that would
translate to the play-offs. Hopefully, Radulov has his influence. But
regrdless, he's a elite scorer at a bargain basement price. His biggest
sin seems to be he got captaincy over Subban (which was absurd that anyone
thought Subban as captain was an option) and he doesn't diss the coach
that everyone hates.

He's a good players. Neeeds to study Radulov a little, and forget any
lesson he learned from Vanek. That's all.

Marty
Gerry
2016-12-12 11:53:34 UTC
Permalink
Well, I think he dissed the coach pretty good last week.

Anyway, a lot of guys you just see a glimpse of what they could be, or maybe get a notion of what they could have been, and when they turn out to not quite be that... it leaves a lingering disappointment. I don't think folks expected him to be a soft sniper on the ice. But he is. It's still good. But less than was hoped for. And he seems a little bit prone to whininess in various situations. It's minor stuff. As long as he does actually score.

I definitely would not expect him to last beyond this contract on the Habs, though. At a "bargain" price, the "minor stuff" is totally acceptable. If he commands more of a premium salary... do you keep him at $7M per, say?

l8r,
Gerry
Marty
2016-12-12 21:50:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Gerry
Well, I think he dissed the coach pretty good last week.
Yeah, maybe that will get him a bit of love. LOL.
Post by Gerry
Anyway, a lot of guys you just see a glimpse of what they could be, or
maybe get a notion of what they could have been, and when they turn out
to not quite be that... it leaves a lingering disappointment. I don't
think folks expected him to be a soft sniper on the ice. But he is.
It's still good. But less than was hoped for. And he seems a little
bit prone to whininess in various situations. It's minor stuff. As
long as he does actually score.
I definitely would not expect him to last beyond this contract on the
Habs, though. At a "bargain" price, the "minor stuff" is totally
acceptable. If he commands more of a premium salary... do you keep him
at $7M per, say?
Well, it will be nice to see a little more play-off action before making
final judgements if Max is only a guy who helps you get to the play-off
dance, or if he can be useful there. Again, watching a skill guy like
Radulov hustle might rub off. Even a little would help.

As an aside, Radulov has me thinking we may need to break the bank open
for him. I doubt his pace is going to wane too much, this is how he plays.
I wish we had 3 of him.

Marty
Mike
2016-12-12 15:33:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marty
Worst captain in team history.
The infamous, non-backchecker (on one infamous play).
The guy who is both a coaches pet, and hated by his coach. At least,
according to all the rumors and opinions that surround him.
Aside from that, he leads the 1st place NHL team in goals and points,
after playing though November on some version of a broken foot.
Seriously, he may not play a "hard" game, but he is an effective player,
when not hurt. He goes to soft areas because, unlike most players, he CAN
score from those areas, because he shot is so heavy. If he spent all his
time crashing creases, he'd never be able to feature his heavy wrister. No
one asked Gallagher to blast 20 goals per season using 30-40 wrist shots.
Why do they want Pacs to get all his goals mucking in the crease and
slamming home garbage, and leave his wrist shot unused?
That said, I do want Pacs to develop a more "mucking" attitude that would
translate to the play-offs. Hopefully, Radulov has his influence. But
regrdless, he's a elite scorer at a bargain basement price. His biggest
sin seems to be he got captaincy over Subban (which was absurd that anyone
thought Subban as captain was an option) and he doesn't diss the coach
that everyone hates.
He's a good players. Neeeds to study Radulov a little, and forget any
lesson he learned from Vanek. That's all.
Marty
The problem I have with him is he is inconsistent. He'll go on these
streaks where he gives you that nice warm fuzzy feeling and then he goes
on a powder and disappears for games on end. The broken foot
notwithstanding, his less than stellar start to the year coincided with
an apt observation by Tortorella I thought and it wasn't outside his
character to play as he was playing - shooting from the parking lot as
Knuckles would say of him. He does this all the time and when he does he
puts himself under the microscope and he plays soft. Yes me may get
goals from the outside a bit when he's hot but look at 3 of those goals
Saturday night - he was either in the crease or pretty damn close to it
and he's been hitting people regularly now for a couple of weeks. He
doesn't like to hear it but when he plays more physical good things
happen to him. Its been like that for years. When he plays soft, he
disappears into the weeds and his outside shots become more the norm and
easier to stop. When he uses his frame to hit and move people he become
a more dangerous player - more versatile and unpredictable.
Chuck
2016-12-12 16:22:52 UTC
Permalink
What I don't understand about his broken foot was why didn't it impact his TOI? He isn't productive at half speed, more playing time wasn't going to help, especially when he plays alongside, master of the perimeter, DD. Would it not have been better to have rested him in order to have him back up to speed quicker?
Marty
2016-12-13 00:41:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chuck
What I don't understand about his broken foot was why didn't it impact
his TOI? He isn't productive at half speed, more playing time wasn't
going to help, especially when he plays alongside, master of the
perimeter, DD. Would it not have been better to have rested him in order
to have him back up to speed quicker?
Well, who knows the exact nature of it all. It surely wasn't a badly
broken foot. Maybe a hairline fracture or something. It might be it
doesn't heal any faster with a few minutes less icetime a game. It just
meant he was short of acceleration power. Anyway, he was playing a little
hurt, so really, people have to backtrack a little of the criticism
lately. Lets just hope Gallagher is nursing an injury too that is about to
fully heal.

Marty
Mike
2016-12-13 02:31:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marty
Post by Chuck
What I don't understand about his broken foot was why didn't it impact
his TOI? He isn't productive at half speed, more playing time wasn't
going to help, especially when he plays alongside, master of the
perimeter, DD. Would it not have been better to have rested him in order
to have him back up to speed quicker?
Well, who knows the exact nature of it all. It surely wasn't a badly
broken foot. Maybe a hairline fracture or something. It might be it
doesn't heal any faster with a few minutes less icetime a game. It just
meant he was short of acceleration power. Anyway, he was playing a little
hurt, so really, people have to backtrack a little of the criticism
lately. Lets just hope Gallagher is nursing an injury too that is about to
fully heal.
Marty
Gallagher is playing some of the worst hockey as a Hab in his career.
Tonight he's just awful and is making some terrible puck decisions. IMO,
he's trying too hard. Skating too fast - he's like his hair is on fire.
I hate to say it but the best thing for him might be to skip a game or
two and watch for a bit.

Marty
2016-12-12 21:57:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike
Post by Marty
Worst captain in team history.
The infamous, non-backchecker (on one infamous play).
The guy who is both a coaches pet, and hated by his coach. At least,
according to all the rumors and opinions that surround him.
Aside from that, he leads the 1st place NHL team in goals and points,
after playing though November on some version of a broken foot.
Seriously, he may not play a "hard" game, but he is an effective
player, when not hurt. He goes to soft areas because, unlike most
players, he CAN score from those areas, because he shot is so heavy. If
he spent all his time crashing creases, he'd never be able to feature
his heavy wrister. No one asked Gallagher to blast 20 goals per season
using 30-40 wrist shots. Why do they want Pacs to get all his goals
mucking in the crease and slamming home garbage, and leave his wrist
shot unused?
That said, I do want Pacs to develop a more "mucking" attitude that
would translate to the play-offs. Hopefully, Radulov has his influence.
But regrdless, he's a elite scorer at a bargain basement price. His
biggest sin seems to be he got captaincy over Subban (which was absurd
that anyone thought Subban as captain was an option) and he doesn't
diss the coach that everyone hates.
He's a good players. Neeeds to study Radulov a little, and forget any
lesson he learned from Vanek. That's all.
Marty
The problem I have with him is he is inconsistent. He'll go on these
streaks where he gives you that nice warm fuzzy feeling and then he goes
on a powder and disappears for games on end. The broken foot
notwithstanding, his less than stellar start to the year coincided with
an apt observation by Tortorella I thought and it wasn't outside his
character to play as he was playing - shooting from the parking lot as
Knuckles would say of him. He does this all the time and when he does he
puts himself under the microscope and he plays soft. Yes me may get
goals from the outside a bit when he's hot but look at 3 of those goals
Saturday night - he was either in the crease or pretty damn close to it
and he's been hitting people regularly now for a couple of weeks. He
doesn't like to hear it but when he plays more physical good things
happen to him. Its been like that for years. When he plays soft, he
disappears into the weeds and his outside shots become more the norm and
easier to stop. When he uses his frame to hit and move people he become
a more dangerous player - more versatile and unpredictable.
Had to argue, but still, I'm saying while that is true, he is an offensive
force, and pumps enough goals in every year to be quite effective. You're
right though, more foray's into the dirty areas and he'd be a low 40s goal
scroer, and more dangerous in the play-offs. Not sure if we'll ever get
that, but 30+ goals is still more than most players can offer. We
shouldn't hate on him for not being as gritty as some players, and should
understand that sometimes, with his shot, going to the "quiet" areas makes
sense. If three guy's mucking behind the goal line all the time, there's
no one out front to score. He just needs to mix it up better.

Marty
Jim Bauch
2016-12-13 00:39:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Marty
Post by Mike
Post by Marty
Worst captain in team history.
The infamous, non-backchecker (on one infamous play).
The guy who is both a coaches pet, and hated by his coach. At least,
according to all the rumors and opinions that surround him.
Aside from that, he leads the 1st place NHL team in goals and points,
after playing though November on some version of a broken foot.
Seriously, he may not play a "hard" game, but he is an effective
player, when not hurt. He goes to soft areas because, unlike most
players, he CAN score from those areas, because he shot is so heavy. If
he spent all his time crashing creases, he'd never be able to feature
his heavy wrister. No one asked Gallagher to blast 20 goals per season
using 30-40 wrist shots. Why do they want Pacs to get all his goals
mucking in the crease and slamming home garbage, and leave his wrist
shot unused?
That said, I do want Pacs to develop a more "mucking" attitude that
would translate to the play-offs. Hopefully, Radulov has his influence.
But regrdless, he's a elite scorer at a bargain basement price. His
biggest sin seems to be he got captaincy over Subban (which was absurd
that anyone thought Subban as captain was an option) and he doesn't
diss the coach that everyone hates.
He's a good players. Neeeds to study Radulov a little, and forget any
lesson he learned from Vanek. That's all.
Marty
The problem I have with him is he is inconsistent. He'll go on these
streaks where he gives you that nice warm fuzzy feeling and then he goes
on a powder and disappears for games on end. The broken foot
notwithstanding, his less than stellar start to the year coincided with
an apt observation by Tortorella I thought and it wasn't outside his
character to play as he was playing - shooting from the parking lot as
Knuckles would say of him. He does this all the time and when he does he
puts himself under the microscope and he plays soft. Yes me may get
goals from the outside a bit when he's hot but look at 3 of those goals
Saturday night - he was either in the crease or pretty damn close to it
and he's been hitting people regularly now for a couple of weeks. He
doesn't like to hear it but when he plays more physical good things
happen to him. Its been like that for years. When he plays soft, he
disappears into the weeds and his outside shots become more the norm and
easier to stop. When he uses his frame to hit and move people he become
a more dangerous player - more versatile and unpredictable.
Had to argue, but still, I'm saying while that is true, he is an offensive
force, and pumps enough goals in every year to be quite effective. You're
right though, more foray's into the dirty areas and he'd be a low 40s goal
scroer, and more dangerous in the play-offs. Not sure if we'll ever get
that, but 30+ goals is still more than most players can offer. We
shouldn't hate on him for not being as gritty as some players, and should
understand that sometimes, with his shot, going to the "quiet" areas makes
sense. If three guy's mucking behind the goal line all the time, there's
no one out front to score. He just needs to mix it up better.
Marty
Yeah, even if Max is "only" a 35-goal perimeter scorer, that's still something the Habs need. Goal scoring is the most precious commodity in the NHL, and a shot that goes in from the perimeter counts just as much as a shot that goes in from the slot after powering through three defenders.

Jim

Gerry makes a fair point about just how much cap space it makes sense to commit to him, but he'd be hard to replace.
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